C4D serial digits not unique?

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On 24/01/2010 at 16:54, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Atm, I do refunds on the spot telling them straight
that this number is floating around the web and can not be accepted.

I add that if this is a mistake, from my side, they are welcome
to sort it out per mail. Never happened yet………

Usually (with other numbers) I simply answer that they are welcome
to send a valid number and the license is on "hold" since I state
that there is no refund at my shop. Also works, it's just sad to have to
do those mails.

Cheers
Lennart

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On 25/01/2010 at 06:04, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Sounds reasonable. Did the same now
Thanks Lennart!

Cheers,
Jack

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On 25/01/2010 at 09:16, xxxxxxxx wrote:

thats how i do it as well and nobody has ever complained yet

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On 03/02/2010 at 08:15, xxxxxxxx wrote:

ok, that's a solution for the "12345" digits. But how can we detect other illegal digits? If we are intended by MAXON to deny plugin licenses for illegal C4D numbers, we need a database to validate the number.

A few moments ago, another customer has asked for a new plugin license, because his c4d base number has changed when upgrading to R11.5.So there is still the question, whether that is possible in a legal way.

@Maxon: How can it happen, that a customer gets a new base number when upgrading to X.5 (excluding the multi-license reason)?

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On 03/02/2010 at 08:53, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Howdy,

Originally posted by xxxxxxxx

... But how can we detect other illegal digits? If we are intended by MAXON to deny plugin licenses for illegal C4D numbers, we need a database to validate the number....

Well, there could be illegal cracked serial numbers floating around out there of which Maxon may not be aware, not to mention those people who are pooling their money and sharing a serial number, so I doubt there is a completely accurate list of illegal copies of Cinema 4D.

Originally posted by xxxxxxxx

..,A few moments ago, another customer has asked for a new plugin license, because his c4d base number has changed when upgrading to R11.5.So there is still the question, whether that is possible in a legal way.

@Maxon: How can it happen, that a customer gets a new base number when upgrading to X.5 (excluding the multi-license reason)?

Well, if a user is upgrading an R11.0 educational version to an R11.5 full version, the base serial number would probably change. I believe that the 6th digit determines whether or not it's an educational version. If it is an educational to full upgrade, then you might want to offer a special upgrade price for the plugin.

Adios,
Cactus Dan

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On 08/02/2010 at 07:56, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Well..  I'm officially part of the club now.  I got a serial number with the last four digits 12345.    This must definitely be a number generator.   My response to this person was...

"This is a serial number that has been flagged as pirated.  Please contact Maxon to resolve this matter.    I am unable to send you a serial number until you provide me with a valid Cinema 4D serial number.  "

Does that seem like a fair statement?

~Shawn

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On 24/02/2010 at 05:22, xxxxxxxx wrote:

I've just checked my database for multiple c4d serial digits belonging to different customers. I countered only numbers, that occur more than 3 times. This is the result:

10002012978: 11
10032001069: 9
10100012345: 10
10100059094: 25

This shows, that sus**cious numbers are not always as obvious as the 12345 number. Fortunately there are only two R11 serials.

I'm thinking about a database for us to query and check for sus**cious numbers at least to handle the "new serial when upgrading to .5" issues...

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On 25/02/2010 at 07:45, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Yeah, right now 10100059094 is pretty popular.....
I must say this is starting to get annoying but I guess there
is nothing much to do other than possible add the numbers
that are proven dizzy here at this thread.
Mean while double check my register for each new sale.

Cheers
Lennart

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On 01/03/2010 at 07:24, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Ok, this is not funny anymore……….
What are the chances to make some sort of "data base".

I don't like this situation when almost I daily must respond
to customers explaining the situation.

I'd even go as far as paying for some sort of
"Maxon Qualified Serial Support".

What can be done?

Cheers
Lennart

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On 01/03/2010 at 07:58, xxxxxxxx wrote:

I second that.  Let's start a database.  I would be happy to host it at my site.     Any thoughts on how we can do this?

~Shawn

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On 02/03/2010 at 16:00, xxxxxxxx wrote:

So does everyone that encounters this send the money back?    Is it legal to say that they are no refunds?

~Shawn

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On 02/03/2010 at 16:28, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Thinking out loud here….

No, I don't think it's wise just keeping the money
as no product is actually shipped.
If not only to to -not- get in trouble if the
person starts to complain at the money transfer partner (PayPal etc).

I -suppose- (I'm not a lawyer or anything) one could
construct a safe reclaimer at the shop that a license
will be shipped after payment -and- when a legit serial is sent.
Until then the delivery is "on hold".

Again, I can't tell if this is water tight internationally or not.
And the sad email conversations will still be a time waster...

Or in more layman terms, "Don't f''k with my time, or pay for it" …

Despite you offer Shawn, I also don't think it is safe to keep serials
outside Maxon.

If anything, maybe there could be a login site (at Maxon) with
a list of suspended numbers. That's all I can think of as possibly realistic.

Cheers
Lennart

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On 02/03/2010 at 16:35, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Yeah you are right,  a Maxon hosted serial database would be ideal.  And you're also right that keeping the money is probably bot a good idea.  Although I think I am going to refund the money minus paypal costs.

It annoys me because it takes up my time to tell these people I can't send them a license for their invalid serial number.  LOL  GRRR.

Thanks for the response Lennart.
~Shawn

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On 03/03/2010 at 01:50, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Just to confirm here, it is definetly an illegal action to not refund the money if you do not provide the customer with the service he paid for. Also it is not legal to not refund the paypal costs, because paypal allows a full refund, which includes any paypal fees, within 90 days. So there is no groundtruth for keeping any money if this is not explicitly stated in your terms of use (and then afaik you cannot simply keep the paypal fees as they are dynamically changing. You´d need to set a fixed fee yourself). It doesn´t really matter if the serial is a valid and legal one in that case.

All I do is simply reject registration and I refund money.

I also agree that MAXON needs to come up with a support strategy here for official third parties. Maybe giving them login data for a database on the maxon server or similar and letting third parties sign an according NDA contract beforehand.

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On 03/03/2010 at 02:40, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Okay.. Thanks Katachi,   Seems like there's nothing we can do about the fact that our time is being wasted here.   It doesn't seem right to me.  

~Shawn

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On 03/03/2010 at 03:14, xxxxxxxx wrote:

yep

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On 03/03/2010 at 06:54, xxxxxxxx wrote:

My plugin shop is fully automated, i.e. the customer is able to download the plugin right after a successful paypal transaction. So the only way for me would be, to validate the c4d serial digits during the ordering and deny the purchase from start up. I'm not willing for the extra work of additional e-mail communications and money refund. Furthermore, customers can also pay via bank transfer so it would be a non-acceptable afford to refund the money in this case.

A database hosted by MAXON, that can be accessed by a php script would be the only way for me to avoid illegal c4d users.

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On 03/03/2010 at 15:07, xxxxxxxx wrote:

what about license depending on hardware like themida, no more worries about sn

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On 04/03/2010 at 10:42, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Originally posted by xxxxxxxx

what about license depending on hardware like themida, no more worries about sn

that would be hell i guess. just imagine you are using your cinema with an usb stick

i think a php accessable database on maxons side would be a good way

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On 05/03/2010 at 03:25, xxxxxxxx wrote:

Well, it would be possible to lock a license to both, C4D serial and e.g. the network adapter's MAC address.
For people who want to use the license on multiple computer, one could let them pay an extra fee and use 00-00-00-00-00-00 als MAC address, signaling the plugin that the MAC should be ignored.
But still, it would not be a pleasant thing for developers and customers.